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Thread: Here it is!

  1. #11
    VCVC Member van-itti's Avatar
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    I was hesitant to tell you guys until he may have lowered his initial quote.

    $1000 for the first one. He came down to $800 after I told him about the potential for more.
    Id like to tell him we need 20 up front and possibly have him to agree to $600. Then there is the 1st gens..
    Like Mark said its a lot of work.
    It would solve a myriad of issues, for me I look at it as an investment and...
    I wont ever have to touch it again.

    So far..7.
    Mike

  2. #12
    VCVC Charter Member Vanner68's Avatar
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    To be honest, for a complete, no splice, correct harness $800 is about right.

    Many years ago, I rewired my 53 F100 from headlight to taillight with bulk wire and reusing the original connectors. I did it in 8 hours, and there is very little wiring on one of those trucks.

    Here is a complete 53 F 100 harness for $525 for comparison:

    http://midfifty.com/item.php?INV_ID=...h-turn-signals

    If you start modifying it for things like HEI, 10 SI or 12 SI alternator, sound systems, light shows, etc, the cost will go up.

    My personal opinion is that we should concentrate on a 'stock' harness to keep costs down. Install the new harness, and make an auxiliary harness for add-ons.
    Gregg Groff


    There's no place like 127.0.0.1

    1968 Chevy G20 108 panel Now with 454 power!

    1965 Chevy G10 panel- OHC Pontiac inline 6

  3. #13
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    My personal opinion is that we should concentrate on a 'stock' harness to keep costs down. Install the new harness, and make an auxiliary harness for add-ons.[/QUOTE]

    This is a very good approach and what I am still planning to do. The original 2nd gen harness is a good starting point. There is a clear and readily available wiring diagram. I'm still looking for a clear 1st gen diagram. Something I can blow up to a large sheet. So far, I have taken apart four 2nd gen harnesses and I've got several more in reserve. The bad news is only two of them were the same. These three different harness types were different enough to cause problems if they were swapped. I've also found errors on the diagram and differences between the diagram and the harnesses. All of this has slowed my progress on this project. The best solution, IMHO, is to build a harness based on the wiring diagram of the 68 2nd gen.
    For a replacement harness, I would use the original colors as the 68 diagram, the same connectors, better wire, original type flashers, ATO fuse panel, more overload protection and certainly make it upgradable. Engine side harness would be a separate unit and would be more work for installers and harness builder. I'd certainly include upgrades for a larger alternator (12SI minimum), HEI and electric fan but leave in place the original type system wiring for those that have not yet upgraded their distributor or alternator. I'd start by building a six cylinder engine harness since that is the more common.

    If I had 3 or 4 tested and ready 2nd gen harnesses right now, I'd sell them on an exchange basis. Send me the old one and get a core charge returned. I've learned much from taking apart the ones I have already. I'd learn more by taking apart returned cores. That would make the product better. Let's face it, the stock harness was marginal at best and over the years it becomes an increasing problem. Look at how Smiley has been battling his son's electrical issues. He's on verge of selling his van because the wiring has made it unreliable. Breaks my heart to see young members maybe leaving the club like that.
    Another issue is that even if there was such a thing as a perfect harness, members are going to have issues after install. Then they'll call you up and request tech support. That's going to be like someone calling you and to say they have a flat tire and want you to tell them where the hole is.

    Someone spends $800 on a harness they'll have high expectations. I would. When you buy an electrical device or harness over the counter, they'll say "It's been tested, it's good. If you smoke it, there's something wrong down the line on your end, no easy returns usually. I'm hope I'm not coming across as complaining, I'm just saying all this to voice my thoughts and experience. So many other projects have gotten in front of this "build a harness" job. The latest is the 3D print of 1st gen defroster vents. But that's another post.
    108VanGuy...
    1969 Chevy Panel, 250 CID, 3 Spd.with OD, 3.36 "WedgieVan" Daily Driver
    1967 Chevy Panel, 230 CID, 3 Spd. 3.36 "UtiliVan" 292 TFI coming. Owned since 76
    1964 GMC Panel, 194 CID, 3 Spd. "CrunchoVan"
    1965 GMC HandiBus Custom, 194 CID, 3 Spd. "MilkVan" Seized Engine
    1965 Chevy Panel 350 CID, 3 Spd. "RustoRoof" Runs but wiring bad
    1969 Chevy 108 Display 307 CID THM 350 Power Brakes 3.73 Posi
    1965 Chevy Panel, V8, 3 Spd. "Gold Hills Van" Best body of my 65s
    1965 CamperVan, V8, 3 Spd.

  4. #14
    VCVC Member Wookee's Avatar
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    Cool

    Here is yet another issue to ponder.
    The General ran the harness up the a pillar along the inner body frame work.
    This is a pretty hard place to run wires correctly now the vans have aged.

    The biggest issue is.IF an interior is installed using sheet metal screws.The chances of damaging this harnes ran through this tube / support.is very real...BTDT.
    These screws can also leave very sharp hidden burs on the inside of the upper body support tube.

    A replacement could easily be run along the drivers side or the dog house.Then along the Divers side wheel well on the floor,at the bottom of the side post ribs.Secured correctly I really do not think this would be an issue.
    Very few owners leave the vans bare naked on the inside.90 percent here have put plywood on the floors and walls .With this plywood installed correctly The new harness could lay between the floor plywood and the side posts.Never to be seen again.Also with the interior built with this in mind the harness would be totally accessible .The dome light wire leads would have to be manufactured longer.Adding wires for a sound system would also be a lot easier.

    The General built Vans to work.With that in mind you can see why he ran the tail light /dome light harness the way he did ...
    Last edited by Wookee; 10-08-2017 at 03:37 AM.
    Its a "van thing". A life style you have to live to understand!!!!

  5. #15
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    Good Thoughts Wookee

    The 2nd gen driver's side pillar wiring harness run to the dome light, tail lights and fuel gauge have a connector to the main harness near the lower end of pillar. I would keep that connector on any replacement harness. This would allow that back wiring section to be a separate replacement, if desired. This would help keep costs down somewhat. Certainly it would make installation of the main harness easier. Less problems seem to occur with that section with the exception of the connectors very near the tail/turn/stop lights which are easily accessed. For rear section rewiring of VCVans with existing builds, it's more complicated as you pointed out. There's many ways to approach the issue but I would favor attacking that job separately. The ideal main harness, IMHO, is one that can be installed in a day without downing the van. This would be the harness that would run from the connector at the engine compartment located under the driver's seat, up to the driver's side pillar connector and include all the under dash wiring, connectors and bulbs. The other two harnesses, (engine and rear run) can be done separately. This would be the approach for running, operational vans. For vans under construction, why not do it all? This is where you can really get carried away. This list of what you could do and wiring requirements for it get big real quick. Electrical infrastructure in any endeavor is expensive but allows for so many desirable options. When not enough circuits exist, the temptation is to tap into an existing one. Too many loads on the same circuit, well, complicates things. Even with the above approach of just making a main harness, a big weak point remains. That point is the connector to the engine harness under the driver's seat. Many wiring issues are right there. To do it right, you would replace that connector with something real nice, weather tight, and with at least one higher amperage circuit. Good connectors like that drive costs way up. Eliminate the connector altogether and your into splicing on the install and dicing if there is an engine replacement. Keep the same connector at that spot and you'll have a new interior connector and an old and likely a poor connection issue on the engine side. If you include a pigtail for the engine side, you're back to splicing to install. Am I overthinking this?
    108VanGuy...
    1969 Chevy Panel, 250 CID, 3 Spd.with OD, 3.36 "WedgieVan" Daily Driver
    1967 Chevy Panel, 230 CID, 3 Spd. 3.36 "UtiliVan" 292 TFI coming. Owned since 76
    1964 GMC Panel, 194 CID, 3 Spd. "CrunchoVan"
    1965 GMC HandiBus Custom, 194 CID, 3 Spd. "MilkVan" Seized Engine
    1965 Chevy Panel 350 CID, 3 Spd. "RustoRoof" Runs but wiring bad
    1969 Chevy 108 Display 307 CID THM 350 Power Brakes 3.73 Posi
    1965 Chevy Panel, V8, 3 Spd. "Gold Hills Van" Best body of my 65s
    1965 CamperVan, V8, 3 Spd.

  6. #16
    VCVC Member van-itti's Avatar
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    good thoughts everyone

    This is exactly why Im doing it this way. Harness will be the front only. For now..
    All underdash from the upgraded blade type fuse box with extra circuits also will include gauge hook-ups, not idiot lights, from the column C shaped connector to the A pillar connector to the engine connector under the seat.
    The rear "pig tail" will have many options to consider as well as the engine harness. Im hoping the original connector under the seat will be fine.
    It is looking more like the core would be necessary to construct the new from.

    If an upgrade is wanted you might want to see if it is available from him when you place an order.

    Eventually would like to have the rear to include extra LED lights, power outlets/USBs, maybe a solar panel hookup..lots to consider there.
    Then theres the engine configurations...

    So right now Im getting the one and will have the complete remove/install posted.

    IF you would want one, please post.
    Mike

  7. #17
    VCVC Member cruzbox's Avatar
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    Im interested.

    Definitely interested in a up dated new harness for me "67", what it comes down to is cost. As mentioned above high cost, high expectations! Up to this post my thinking was to add a separate new fuse block for any and all add on's, fans, Gage's , AC, ECT.
    Keep up the good investigation.
    Cruzbox

  8. #18
    VCVC Charter Member Vanner68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cruzbox View Post
    Definitely interested in a up dated new harness for me "67", what it comes down to is cost. As mentioned above high cost, high expectations! Up to this post my thinking was to add a separate new fuse block for any and all add on's, fans, Gage's , AC, ECT.
    Keep up the good investigation.
    Cruzbox
    I would definitely go with a separate fuse box / wiring for 'add-ons', if only for the reason that if the 60" flatscreen/DVD/10000 watt sound system/smoke machine decides to fry, the van's stock systems will still work well enough to get you home.
    Gregg Groff


    There's no place like 127.0.0.1

    1968 Chevy G20 108 panel Now with 454 power!

    1965 Chevy G10 panel- OHC Pontiac inline 6

  9. #19
    Van Addict
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    Wiring Harness

    I would like a harness each for both my first and second generation vans.

    Something under $500 each (from tip to tail) would make me happy. Maybe that's not realistic.

    Ian
    Last edited by Canad-Ian; 10-23-2017 at 12:13 AM.

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